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Interview with Satoshi Takeda, 6th Dan
April 1997, Canberra
Nigel Carruthers-Taylor (NCT): Satoshi Sensei thank you for agreeing
to this interview. How long have you been training Aikido?
Satoshi Sensei: This is my 27th year.
NCT: Have you studied any other martial arts?
Satoshi Sensei: In my high school days I studied Kendo for four years.
NCT: I also know that you like Tea Ceremony very much.
Satoshi Sensei: Yes, I've studied Tea Ceremony for 24 years. I have a
licence - a Dan grading.
NCT: Do you find that Tea Ceremony is good for your Aikido?
Satoshi Sensei: Yes, it increases inspiration and catches a good
feeling. The style I study is for celebrations - it's very important not to use
force. The touch has to be very light, and the mind must not be broken. We use
high quality tea and pottery, and the whole feeling is important - the tea
house, calligraphy, ikebana. The whole thing must be in harmony and the set-up
is very important. Next week, when I go back to Japan, I will have a tea
ceremony.
NCT: You have been to Australia many times now. When was the first
time that you came?
Satoshi Sensei: In 1989 I came to the Gold Coast, and Summer Camp in
Newcastle. I have been to Australia 12 or 13 times since. I enjoy Australia very
much. Sunshine Coast, Noosa, Melanie, are very lovely areas. Melbourne and
Sydney have a good feeling - very much like Yokohama, a very exciting feeling.
NCT: Have you trained with Takeda, Yoshinobu Sensei for all of your
training years?
Satoshi Sensei: Yes, sometimes I studied with Yamaguchi Sensei, but
mostly with Takeda Sensei.
NCT: You have been teaching us some important Aikido points this
weekend. Can you talk about some of these.
Satoshi Sensei: Before Aikido, to study a Japanese martial arts meant
that you had to select Kenjitsu, Kyujitsu, or Jujitsu. Jujitsu's meaning, well,
a direct translation means soft, but a kind of meaning included force: making
free movement. Aikido is basically Jujitsu, but O'Sensei studied Shinto
Religion, and made Aikido philosophical and spiritual. This is different from
other martial arts. Very high level thinking and soul connection. The other
martial arts focus on killing and fighting techniques. O'Sensei wanted to change
this and give harmony with the Universe. A very important philosophy.
NCT: And a very difficult one to understand!
Satoshi Sensei: For me too!
NCT: For Aikido students this kind of philosophy is like walking
through a fog - its very difficult to see what it is.
Satoshi Sensei: Yes, you must build up yourself and the inspiration
will come. You have the ability to make this inspiration. But you need a pure
mind. Just playing martial arts and having a business money mind will not help
you progress - you will not get the inspiration.
NCT: For Australian students it's very difficult to understand
O'Sensei's philosophy. We can only read books about it, and these are very
difficult to read. What are some important points?
Satoshi Sensei: It's very difficult to explain. You need direct
experience. The Kotodama is very old, and even in Japan this is being lost.
Japan is getting American mind, American culture now. Kotodama is very
historical and O'Sensei liked Shintoism, where the Kotodama came from. But don't
think about history, it's important to live now and look to the future. We need
a Kotodama research institute - a University!
NCT: What do you think about Zen?
Satoshi Sensei: I'm from a Buddhist Sect, which is Zen, but I don't
like Zen. Zen is very tiring! Western people like Zen and like meditation, which
is very useful. Zen mind, Zen spirit wants concentration and focus - no thinking
and a clear mind. No thinking money, no thinking house, just spiritual.
NCT: In our day to day practice are any of these philosophies
important, or should we just practice the best we can?
Satoshi Sensei: The philosophies are important but in our practice we
need to be very simple and easy. No thinking. I noticed at this camp that the
high kyu grades very quickly copied my movements. But the old students have much
Aikido information in their mind, and they need to take in the information that
is here now. The white belt people didn't have prior information and very
quickly learned.
NCT: I see - us black belts have a lot to learn. Or perhaps a lot to
forget! This weekend you've been talking a lot about Mawai (distance), center
movement, and so on. Could you talk about some of these.
Satoshi Sensei: It's very simple. Just catch the attacking feeling.
Some people open their eyes, but too late! Why too late? Too much alcohol, much
eating, much sweets. Then the feeling is too late. You need a sharpness, a self
control. You need to keep the Aikido feeling at all times - outside the dojo as
well as in. A lot of people just come in and keep the Aikido feeling in their
training, but lose it when they aren't training. They just enjoy life without
the sharpness and clarity that Aikido brings -why bother training! You need mind
and body control to make life more happy.
NCT: So you think that this sharpness can come from cleaner living.
Are lifestyle and nutrition important to develop the feeling in Aikido?
Satoshi Sensei: Of course. I like good food - fish, tofu, vegetables.
Not so much heavy food such as meat, sweets, soft drink. There is much more
potential to develop Ki with good food. Ki is a concentration of will. Not
necessarily macrobiotics, this is very hard - makes your mind hard. Just eat
good food, not heavy food.
NCT: This weekend you've talked a lot about Ki. Do you think it's
important in Aikido to feel the Ki coming before the movement comes? How do you
help do this?
Satoshi Sensei: Just technique, and keep healthy. Ki comes from the
Japanese word Genki, which means an energetic and dynamic feeling. Sick people
are not genki. Young people are genki. When we have Ki we are lighter, we are
energetic. Making Ki is very simple, just lead a healthy life. And thinking is
very important - if we have challenge in our life, it's Kiai, Ki is lightened
and pointed, and we have a good life. If we are lazy, have too much money, eat
too much, we become overweight and negative - then there's no Kiai. Then Ki is
lost and life is no good. You must match your life cycle with the nature cycle,
for example if you drink alcohol at midnight you're energy is lost.
NCT: Sensei, you have been teaching us a lot of bokken movement. Do
you think this is important to learning Aikido?
Satoshi Sensei: Yes. Bokken comes from Kenjitsu style. But our
movement comes from Takeda Sensei's irimi and tenkan, this movement has
instruction for our students. We join the bokken and the whole body. This
develops the whole movement - mind and body together. But don't confuse Aikido
movements with Kenjitsu, Kendo or Iaido. They are all different. Over the past
three years I have been teaching irimi and tenkan movements to beginners with
the bokken - through this they pick the movement very quickly. Beginners don't
have the knowledge of Aikido, and bokken paints a picture of the movement.
NCT: What do you recommend for Australian students?
Satoshi Sensei: Bokken is extremely useful for Australians too. More
practice of ukemi is also needed. I learn Aikido every day - ukemi picks up the
feeling of Aikido. No thinking, just doing. Some people have a duty mind - very
tired. You need an interest in Aikido - a kind of independent mind that seeks
the inspiration of Aikido.
NCT: Tell us more about the new organisation - Aikido Kenkyu Kai. What
is the meaning of the words and what is the vision?
Satoshi Sensei: Kenkyu Kai means Institute - so it is an Aikido
Institute. It is a research network for Aikido. My dream is that it is a further
development of the Shonan Renmei philosophy to Aikido. For a long time Takeda
Sensei helped foreign students - people from United States, Germany, as well as
Australia, New Zealand and Canada. But now the organisation has grown. These
people have left Japan and returned to their own countries and opened dojos. But
they need more Aikido information and instruction - a small organisation cannot
help them. We need to help them with senior instructors, they need support. It
is important that we support them and help them to expand the Shonan Renmei
style, CDC (Cultural Development through Collaboration) style. This is a human
development - it will provide support into the next century. As we get more
black belts they will expand again, and we need this network to support them. It
is for the future.
NCT: Is Aikido Kenkyu Kai also about expanding the feeling of Aikido,
so that Aikido is not so traditional?
Satoshi Sensei: Yes, traditional style is stuck in time. People's
minds are changing over time. Aikido also needs to change to fit modern times.
CDC Aikido is always changing. Each new generation will change the style.
Japanese traditional culture finished development a long time ago -Edo time, and
is now just being kept the same - maintained, no development - like Kabuki
(traditional theatre), it's just entertainment theatre. It has no relevance to
our modern era. Martial arts must change every day to reflect the current times
- it must be relevant. CDC Aikido continues to develop.
NCT: Yes, we've noticed how Takeda Sensei and yourself have changed
many times over the years. So is this part of the Aikido Kenkyu Kai way -to
continue the development of Aikido?
Satoshi Sensei: Yes -we constantly need to refresh the approach -
continue the inspiration. Unfortunately we can't write a text book on this way!
We can't write about the techniques, because photos just show a point in time.
We need to keep the interest in Aikido and keep it fresh - continue to expand
and develop. Not traditional! Australia can become part of this frontier of
development - please study hard and make it yours!
NCT: What countries have Aikido Kenkyu Kai dojos now?
Satoshi Sensei: Yes, there are dojos in Germany, Canada, New Zealand,
United States, and of course Australia. We have also had South Africans and
Brazilians studying with us. Takeda Sensei and other senior instructors are
beginning to travel to these countries to teach. A lot of students are visiting
Japan and studying with Takeda Sensei.
NCT: Some of the important things that we are finding in Australia is
to learn to train with older people, children and people with disabilities. Have
you got some ideas for training with these types of people?
Satoshi Sensei: Everybody has Ki energy, but those with disabilities,
sickness and old age have lower energy. Dojos have a good Ki feeling - a lot of
energy - and these people can pick it up. A lot of these people have lost
self-confidence, but after working hard at Aikido they can do a basic Aikido
movement and catch the Aikido feeling. This opens their energy - and changes
their energy and their body, and can help their recovery. For two years I have
taught a woman's class in Japan. The first two or three months they were scared
- they only did a little ukemi and bokken movement. But slowly they connected
with their Ki and now they are much better. I don't think people need hard
training - just gentle and soft. Sick people need care - during Aikido they
don't get direct care, they learn independence. They still need some time for
learning, ukemi and so on, but in the dojo they can learn about their own
actions. Once they learn movements it boosts their confidence and opens their
Ki, helps recovery. You can see the changes in their faces.
NCT: How about older people?
Satoshi Sensei: Older people have a lot of education and experience -
strong Kiai. But now the Kiai is sleeping, it needs waking up. You need to draw
the energy out through gentle training. Bokken and tenkan movement is very good.
They need to learn self-confidence again. They don't need fast instruction.
NCT: How about children?
Satoshi Sensei: Their energy has no focus. The main point is to teach
them to focus - make one point. Bokken movement is important - it brings their
mind together. Many children are raised in nice houses with nice food, a lot of
entertainment - focus is lost. Just support them and push them gently. You need
to teach them leadership - give certain people some responsibility - this
teaches them to focus. Each day you may have a different leader - this person
has responsibility which opens their Ki energy. In two or three months you will
see a real change in their bodies and attitude.
NCT: Do you suggest dietary changes to help people open their Ki?
Satoshi Sensei: Just making suggestions that's all - clean food - but
not forcing changes on them. It's just an education process on human nature. We
encourage fewer sweets, less TV, more exercise outside, with groups and so on.
NCT: Is there anything else that you would like to tell us?
Satoshi Sensei: Think of the Way of harmony with the Universe. Include
the deep philosophy in your study. There is much variation. including social
harmony, and you need to have a community mind. It's very simple - think of your
actions, how does your mind meet this harmony?
NCT: Takeda Sensei, thank you very much for this interview, and I hope
we will see you again in Australia soon.
Satoshi Sensei: Thank you.
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